Innocence until proven guilty

Discussion in 'General Hunting' started by Wildcat, Jan 1, 2004.

  1. Wildcat

    Wildcat 12 pointer

    Jan 7, 2002
    Ledbetter, Ky.
    In the last couple weeks there's been a lot of posts over the CO's, game laws, rules and reulations. I've noticed a lot of people said something like this, "I thought we were innocence until proven guilty or it seems like we're guilty and have to prove our innocence". The truth is you ARE innocence until proven guilty in all maters of the law, they have to prove your guilt in court. The court is where it rests, not on the field or road or where ever it happens at. The law enforcement officers are just doing their jobs, it's the courts job to find you innocence or guilty.

    If you was to get a ticket your still innocence until they prove it in court or you pay the ticket. Ever if they arrest you, book you and put you in jail where you have to post bond to get out you are still innocence until it's tied in court.

    On a side note. Most of you have heard that President Bush went quail hunting in Texas today with his father. It truns out a few years ago while quail hunting he shot a protected bird by mistake and ended up paying a $130 fine. It just goes to show anybody can make a mistake and they can own up to it.
  2. imported_n/a

    imported_n/a 6 pointer

    Nov 30, 2003
    I was innocent with a spotlight but the dep. decided I was quilty and now I can't use one.[?]

    Leave some for the kids!
  3. GSP

    GSP 14 Pointer Staff Member

    Dec 12, 2001
    Very true statement Wildcat.
    Sad thing is, MANY folks roll over and pay fines that are bogus.
    I have a boy that works for me that recieved a ticket last week for
    public intoxication. He was on his dad's farm.
    Bottom line, the guy paid the fine instead of fighting it. He said it wasn't worth the $125 fine to fight it. Though there was no way in h$ll they could convict him.
    Go figure?
  4. Big58cal

    Big58cal 10 pointer

    Dec 10, 2001
    Granted, the above statements are true to a certain extent, but I don't think it's what the majority of people are talking about. From what I've read on other threads here, the attitude is coming from people that are cited for things that should be "no-brainers" for everyone else. The LEO must see something for them to cite people for things, but it seems that some LEO's are citing people without getting the whole story as to what it up. Granted, a LEO can't just take everyone's word for granted as to the situation, and must rely on their training, the situation, and the law, but it seems like some of these things should never be cited.

    Granted, just getting cited doesn't mean that you're "guilty", but in a way it does. It's saying that the LEO saw something that didn't quite look right and decided to take you into court. Then, you go before a judge with both you and the LEO there to tell you sides. If the judge decides that your innocent, then why did the LEO even cite you to start with? It appears as though some LEO's are too quick to hand out a citation without knowing what is going on in the situation. Some don't care and don't want to hear it. These are the one's that end up in court.

    During my time as a LEO, of all of the citations that I wrote, I had to go to court 1 time. All others were either not contested in court or were prepaid. The time that I had to go to court, the judge sided with me as to why I had written the citation and found the person guilty. The reason for either no contest to my citations, prepaying, and the judge siding with me was that I had the people "dead-to-rights". I wish I had a nickle for every time that I let people off with warnings and a "talking-to". If I wrote it, it was good, and it stuck. The reason is that I found everything that I could before-hand.

    I'm not dogging any LEO for writing a citation. They've got their reasons. But if it gets thrown out in court, then there really wasn't a purpose in writing it to start with was there?
  5. jeffd34006

    jeffd34006 6 pointer

    Sep 16, 2003
    Lexington KY, USA.
    I agree w/ you to the point that you say there was no point in writing a ticket if you are found "not guilty" in court. LEO's can do everything right and prosecutors and judges can drop the ball. We have a very difficult, convoluted system in the U.S. But, it's better than anywhere else!!!

    "A hunting license is a ticket to the ultimate health spa. It will cleanse the soul. It has never failed me." Ted Nugent
  6. taggedout

    taggedout 6 pointer

    Dec 17, 2001
    ky, USA.
    In general there is a lack of knowledge pertaining to hunting and fishing rules and regs. by the judges, and they generally go along with whatever the COs say in court. By that same token many judges stand by the accused and dont take the wildlife violations seriously. The COs figure that out real fast... and from there its just what kind of man is behind the badge!

  7. ksp771

    ksp771 10 pointer

    WOW! to all the posts. I had a Mayor tell me several times that I was guilty until proven innocent. I think alot of LEO'S make mistakes because the are human just like everyone else, and also creatures of habit. Anyone ever been in a rut before??????
  8. imported_n/a

    imported_n/a 6 pointer

    Nov 30, 2003
    ksp771, LEO's may be human and subject to falibility, but if your going to pin on the badge then bring your best to the game. You owe it to the people you serve. If not find another occupation.

    Leave some for the kids!
  9. ksp771

    ksp771 10 pointer

    AMEN! Some should not pin on the badge! Integrity, Proper training, and holding oneself to higher regard makes the LEO. I can't tell you how many times I have seen people enter this career just to put on the badge and uniform not wanting to take responsibility for their actions, and should not be in the career if they lack the knowledge and communication skills that are so badly needed in this line of work. Those individuals make all LEO's look as bad as they do and lose the trust of their community and peers. So yes let us bring the best to the game and not hire those who get the job because their Uncle, Cousin, Aunt, whomever helps them to enter this career blindly.

    <blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Captain Mallard</i>
    <br />ksp771, LEO's may be human and subject to falibility, but if your going to pin on the badge then bring your best to the game. You owe it to the people you serve. If not find another occupation.

    Leave some for the kids!
    <hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

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