Texas Could Vote to Secede From U.S. in 2023 as GOP Pushes for Referendum

EdLongshanks

12 pointer
Nov 16, 2013
18,571
Northern Kentucky
YES People dont realize how much federal money goes into Texas. Military for example. If Feds pull just the military would cost Texas dearly. Regualer military and reservist bases.
There are 15 reugalar bases of Army Air Force Navy Marine and Coast Guard. Not counting the hundreds of Army Air national guard plus Reservist Army Navy Marine Air Forse and Coast Guard bases there. Shut those places down pull all the equipment. Empty bases no jobs loses money for the state. BILLIONS LOST.
Then the Oil industry gets federal funding. Cut that out. Jobs lost money lost. Hurricain relief flooding storm dameges. Cut that off. See what happens. Texas be crying to join back into the U.S.
You act as if there is no counter bounce back from that. Have you seen the industries flocking to Texas? You think minute federal goobermint subsidies outweigh what they could do without federal subsidies?!? I’m guessing defense spending is a drop in the overall bucket. Economically Texas would thrive. Period. They would be unfettered. There might be some short term losses but they are currently killing it and that not likely to change.
 

EdLongshanks

12 pointer
Nov 16, 2013
18,571
Northern Kentucky

Texas can’t legally secede from the U.S., despite popular myth​

The theme of independence has recurred throughout the history of Texas, which was a republic from 1836–45. But the Civil War established that a state cannot secede.
BY TEXAS TRIBUNE STAFF JUNE 20, 2022UPDATED: 12 PM CENTRAL
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The Texas and U.S. flag wave in the wind outside of the John Reagan State Office building on Jan. 15, 2020.

The Texas and U.S. flags wave outside the John H. Reagan State Office Building. Credit: Miguel Gutierrez Jr./The Texas Tribune
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In June 2022, the Texas State Republican Convention adopted a platform urging the Legislature to put a referendum before the people of Texas in November 2023 “to determine whether or not the State of Texas should reassert its status as an independent nation.”
Secession and independence have been perennial themes throughout the history of Texas, which broke away from Mexico in 1836 and was an independent republic before it was annexed by the United States in 1845. As the United States was torn apart by divisions over whether slavery could expand into the nation’s western territories, Texas in 1861 voted to secede from the Union. In the ensuing Civil War, up to 750,000 people — more than 2 percent of all Americans — died. Following the defeat of the Confederacy in 1865, Texas was formally readmitted to the Union in 1870, during the Reconstruction Era.
Despite perennial talk of another secession, the law is clear that Texas may not leave the union.
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The idea is most often raised by conservatives in the state who are angry over some kind of policy coming from the federal government — and the calls seem to become more frequent when a Democrat is occupying the White House. State Rep. Kyle Biedermann, R-Fredericksburg, filed a bill in 2021 to create a referendum election on whether Texans should create a joint legislative committee “to develop a plan for achieving Texas independence.”
“It is now time that the People of Texas are allowed the right to decide their own future,” he said in a statement announcing the legislation.
Even if the Legislature were to act on the new Republican Party proposal to put an independence referendum on the general election, it would not be legally valid.
“The legality of seceding is problematic,” Eric McDaniel, associate professor of government at the University of Texas at Austin, told The Texas Tribune in 2016. “The Civil War played a very big role in establishing the power of the federal government and cementing that the federal government has the final say in these issues.”
Many historians believe that when the Confederacy surrendered at Appomattox in 1865, the idea of secession was forever defeated, McDaniel said. The Union’s victory set a precedent that states could not legally secede.

Even before Texas formally rejoined the nation, the U.S. Supreme Court declared that secession had never been legal, and that, even during the rebellion, Texas continued to be a state.
In the 1869 case Texas v. White, the court held that individual states could not unilaterally secede from the Union and that the acts of the insurgent Texas Legislature — even if ratified by a majority of Texans — were “absolutely null.”
When Texas entered the Union, “she entered into an indissoluble relation,” Chief Justice Salmon P. Chase wrote for the court. “All the obligations of perpetual union, and all the guaranties of republican government in the Union, attached at once to the State. The act which consummated her admission into the Union was something more than a compact; it was the incorporation of a new member into the political body. And it was final. The union between Texas and the other States was as complete, as perpetual, and as indissoluble as the union between the original States. There was no place for reconsideration, or revocation, except through revolution, or through consent of the States.”
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Chase added: “The ordinance of secession, adopted by the convention and ratified by a majority of the citizens of Texas, and all the acts of her legislature intended to give effect to that ordinance, were absolutely null. They were utterly without operation in law.”
Another source of confusion and misinformation over the years has been language in the 1845 annexation resolution that Texas could, in the future, choose to divide itself into “New States of convenient size not exceeding four in number, in addition to said State of Texas.” But the language of the resolution says merely Texas could be split into five new states. It says nothing of splitting apart from the United States. Only Congress has the power to admit new states to the Union, which last occurred in 1959 with the admission of Alaska and Hawaii.
If there were any doubt remaining after this matter, the late Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia set it to rest when he asked by a screenwriter in 2006 whether there was a legal basis for secession. In his response, he wrote: “The answer is clear,” Scalia wrote. “If there was any constitutional issue resolved by the Civil War, it is that there is no right to secede. (Hence, in the Pledge of Allegiance, ‘one Nation, indivisible.’)”
Yeah exactly. Let’s go to war and see what happens.
 

DH13

12 pointer
Jan 13, 2012
8,788
Shelby county
You act as if there is no counter bounce back from that. Have you seen the industries flocking to Texas? You think minute federal goobermint subsidies outweigh what they could do without federal subsidies?!? I’m guessing defense spending is a drop in the overall bucket. Economically Texas would thrive. Period. They would be unfettered. There might be some short term losses but they are currently killing it and that not likely to change.
Do you think those companies wouls stay there? Texas takes in more Federal money than it pays in.
Thrive without most federal and state jobs gone.
 

DH13

12 pointer
Jan 13, 2012
8,788
Shelby county
Yeah exactly. Let’s go to war and see what happens.
Hard to fight when have no equipment to fight with. They dont get to keep military equipment. That stuff dont stay. But facts are Texas cant brake away anyways. Why would they? Lose represitation in House and Senate. Take away 38 electorial votes and federal money. They cant keep electric on in a snow storm. Much less fight a war.
 

EdLongshanks

12 pointer
Nov 16, 2013
18,571
Northern Kentucky
Do you think those companies wouls stay there? Texas takes in more Federal money than it pays in.
Thrive without most federal and state jobs gone.
That’s just a misnomer. Those funds are for agriculture and mining. Take those away and simultaneously take away the Ridiculous epa restrictions, I’ll take Texas every time. And yes companies like lesser taxes and cheap energy. That’s without question
 

EdLongshanks

12 pointer
Nov 16, 2013
18,571
Northern Kentucky
Hard to fight when have no equipment to fight with. They dont get to keep military equipment. That stuff dont stay. But facts are Texas cant brake away anyways. Why would they? Lose represitation in House and Senate. Take away 38 electorial votes and federal money. They cant keep electric on in a snow storm. Much less fight a war.
The snow storm was an anomaly and you think Texas hasn’t bolstered their energy grid since? Cmon man. War? No shots need to be fired in a conventional sense at all. Cmon man.
 

Jmd

6 pointer
Sep 26, 2016
133
Teaxs is Texas ALL TALK. It isnt going anywhere.
For you history buffs, I believe part of northern california was going to LEAVE california and the vote was to be held on Dec 8, 1941. Then Dec,7. Vote did not take place.
 

Gforcetrivers

12 pointer
Sep 23, 2016
3,217
Burkesville
Hard to fight when have no equipment to fight with. They dont get to keep military equipment. That stuff dont stay. But facts are Texas cant brake away anyways. Why would they? Lose represitation in House and Senate. Take away 38 electorial votes and federal money. They cant keep electric on in a snow storm. Much less fight a war.
It stayed in Afghanistan
 

timer

12 pointer
Feb 20, 2013
2,065
La Grange
I know it's all talk....but I'd kinda hate to lose Texas. On the other hand, California....

I believe it was General Sheridan who said, "If the Good Lord saw fit to give me both Hell and Texas, I'd rent out Texas....and I'd live in Hell."
 


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